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Motherboard: You’re not new to the format, what with your WFMU show, but I wonder what led you to return to it, and what’s valuable about a podcast from your perspective. The internet breaks everything down into its component parts.So even if we’re going to do a “real person doing real things” interview, it should stand on its own as a component.Yeah, well, that’s part of the reason I started the show. The thing that surprised me—the thing I’m working through now—is this whole idea of guaranteed minimum income.The main thing I’m getting is deluged by people looking for specific answers. I make a pretty strong case for it in the book: In a society with abundant resources, people deserve food, housing, and medical care. But I spent some time at Uber, and I heard my guaranteed minimum income argument come back to me but from their lips, and it sounded different.And I’m still working on this problem, since I believe that food, housing, and medical care are basic human rights for which you shouldn’t need a job, but I don’t like how guaranteed minimum income becomes an excuse for more exploitation of those at the bottom, and a new two-tiered society.Given what you’ve written recently, including the piece about Trump being the epitome of a “digital” candidate, do you have any particular hope for the way the internet develops, going forward?“When I first heard digital,” Douglas Rushkoff said at a book event in May, launching into a thought stream, a gyroscopic, physical whirligig of economic theories, history, and emphatic hand gestures, “this is what I thought of as the digits,” and he flitted his fingers.

What does convenience really mean in a digital age? Ah, pretty colors, swipe, swipe, it’s all good,” he said, looking into his hands, mimicking browsing on a smartphone. Its really going to hit you like a ton of bricks eventually.It just creates more cash for people to spend as consumers.It doesn’t give the workers any more ownership of the “means of production” than they had before.So now, each show is basically a single theme, with a monologue by me and a conversation with a guest.It’s much more about the live engagement than whatever book or accomplishment the guest comes with.

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